"When this card enter play, Progeny deals each hero target 1 fire damage. Then, if there are 3 or more scion cards in play, destroy 1 scion card other than this card. Increase damage dealt by Progeny by 1."
When this card enters play, each hero target takes:
A) 1 fire damage, because it hasn't "finished entering play" yet, so the damage boost caused by the second paragraph doesn't apply.
B) 2 fire damage, because the text of the card all enters play simultaneously. If the card is "in play" enough to do damage, then the damage boost must be in play as well.
I am leaning towards B, but others in my playgroup argued for A. Thoughts?
If it was a Oneshot, then it would be A, because you'd be following the sequence of the card. But because it stays in play, that makes the damage increase effect a static effect which is always active, including when the first ability goes off. Like Pydro said, it's B.
Are we sure on that? Because there's a couple of The Naturalist threads which say you can use Beastial Shift to active the Gazelle Icon if you change into it from Croc Icon's power use. (Personally I am with Lupus in that you can never go home again backwards on a card)
There is an innate difference in how Naturalist works mechanically. If you are allowed to activate form icons, you may do so. In that case, the ordering of those icons on his one-shots is irrelevant. If you are in the form, you can activate the effect while that one-shot is still in play resolving.
Threatening Stomps Rhino effect is has a conditional clause to it first of all, you can't just choose to trigger it whenever you want. It happens after damage is dealt, and only after the damage is dealt.
It honestly wouldn't make a difference if the icon text was written first on the card, which is my original point.
Bestial shift works like that because you are activating the text on the card that goes with your form, the other text doesn't do a check and pass or fail, the text enters play and you have the choice to activate any text that is able to acivate.
The text after an Icon that you don't have the right to choose to activate is ignored, it isn't failed. If a new form card enters play you would immediately have the option to activate that icon's text or not.
For me I would say that if you are running a Fixed Point Crocazellhino you would have the option to activate each effect or not, but would have to do it in order, because the option to do each thing is there, so you resolve the card text in the order it is on the card.
For all intents and Purposes the text following an icon is ignored unless there is text in play saying that you may activate it.
When you change forms the text you just used is gone, and new text is there that you have to deal with.
Wasn't there talk (between Fixed Point shenanigans and symbol effects that allow The Naturalist to use Transform mid one-shot) about him having to go from top to bottom with his activation effects? For instance if he had a card with [R] [G] [C] (no idea if he has that or not) from top to bottom and he was a Rhinocedile he would have to activate the [R] effect before the [C] effect?
Fixed Point makes cards indestructible. Oneshots though are not destroyed when they resolve; they are put into the trash, so how they work is unaffected by Fixed Point. That cuts on a lot of shenanigans.
As for the difference between oneshots and ongoings, and static effects on them, there isn't any. Oneshots are just cards that happen to be put into the trash as part of their resolution. So if a hypothetical one shot had a text reading "Hero deals 1 melee damage to target. Damage dealt by Hero is increased by 1 until the start of his next turn." then Hero would end up dealing 2 damage with that card, regardless of the order of those two sentences.