Does Kismet's Lady Luck card prevent Kismet herself from being destroyed? If so, what happens to her HP? If she was at 3 health and took 4 damage, will she remain at 3 health, or will she have -1? If it's the latter, what happens then?
... and what would happen if the card was a lucky, "Fortune's smile" ...
Kismet regains (H) hp and deals each hero target 1 psychic damage.Play the top card of the villan deck.
... would her healing prevent the heroes from winning (assuming that kismet would have 1 or more hp after healing), or would it be too late
Ummm…What? I do not quite understand the question.
Kismet is not a Jinx card if thats what you are thinking. Lady Luck only applies to when you are trying to destroy her ongoings.
Do you mean Inconcievable Obstruction? That could certainly prevent you from destroying her, as that last bit of damage could be redirected to an enviro target. If you can clarify your question a bit, I could try and help a bit more.
Urgh, Lady Luck is a horrible card - it usually takes us multiple attempts to get rid of it because it keeps preventing its own destruction. Grr :P.
Yeah, usually once Lady Luck hits the table, unless I get real lucky with the first ongoing destruction, I stop focusing on those all together and just start playing Hot Potato with her Charm and try and keep her off her front side as much as possible. Her damage increases get nasty real fast with Lady Luck in play.
Whenever a villain card would be destroyedI'm not sure how you get it only effects ongoings.
Bah. Happens every time I type something without the cards in front of me. My appologies. I was talking about it in a pragmatic sense, not how it was actually worded.
Once the Villain character cards HP reaches 0 the game is over, and I believe hitting 0 HP happens before any destruction effects would happen. And since the Charm is indestructable (cant trigger lady luck), then for all intents and purposes, Lady Luck only effects her Ongoings (theres nothing else that would trigger Lady Luck in her deck)
Edit: Actually, I am not quite sure if I am right or wrong about the Win condition. Is the condition when the Villain Character Card(s) is/are reduced to 0 HP, or do the Villain Character cards actually have to pass a "this card is now destroyed" check before poking the fat lady to sing? I believe I am interpreting it correctly above, but I think theres valid arguments in either direction. Anyone care to chime in on this?
According to the Rule Book:
Unless stated otherwise, when a villain character card is reduced to 0 HP, the villain is destroyed and the players have won the game
So the order appears to be 0HP->Destroy->Players win. However, Lady Luck does "state otherwise," and prevents the destruction. It does not prevent the damage dropping her to 0 hp, so she would remain.
I would say Lady Luck could only save Kismet if the card revealed was Fortune's Smile, because she would hit 0 hp, then Lady luck would interrupt (or come before, whatever is most correct) the destruction while it was resolved. If it is not a lucky card the destruction is prevented, but she would remain at 0 hp and as soon as Lady Luck was finished she would be destroyed, just like Fixed Point can keep a 0hp target alive, but only while it is active, the process of 0hp->destroy isn't a one time thing, it keeps trying. If the card revealed was fortune's smile, then it is tricky. It's all on timing there, because the destruction isn't prrevented, but if she is healed between Lady Luck checking and the 0hp->destroy happens then the destruction wouldn't happen anyway.
I think this is a brilliant (or incredible unintentional) play on the whole theme of shattered time. A nice little paradox.
The answer is also in the rule book:
In any Ambiguous situation, the players choose the outcome.
I'd say the timing is pretty ambiguous, so just decide amongst yourselves how to deal with it. I for one would allow it.
The real question would be if Lady Luck triggered on an effect that dropped all Hero and her HP ro 0, if a non-lucky card came up then, wouldn't she win? All Heroes are incapacitated by an effect that does not destroy the villain, so I'd think the Heroes didn't win.
Qualifying this whole post that there may be an official ruling I don't know of that contradicts everything here, this is just my own interpretation of the rule book.
Here is my thought as to what would happen if Kismet would be reduced to 0 or fewer HP while Lady Luck is in play.
She would flip a card, if it is not a Lucky card, she will not be destroyed, but she is still at 0 or fewer HP, thus she will be attempted to be destroyed again, as a target can't remain in play with 0 or fewer HP unless it is indestructible. So it would flip a card again, continueing to do this until a Lucky card is revealed or her deck is empty, whichever comes first. At which point she would be destroyed.
If Fortune's Smile would be revealed, I would say she would still be destroyed, as he destruction effect takes priority over a new card entering play, as she was in play first.
But wouldnt any new card that gets played (like fortune smiles) effect go off immediatly? I thought that any new effects or triggers that happen in the middle of a current action resolve immediatly first, then continue on. Shouldn't Fortune Smile, in that sense, actually save her from destruction as the HP increase would happen before we go back to her destruction check? That seems like it would be consistant with other similar rulings we have.
On the killing blow to Kismet, you would probably have to track into the negitive HP to make absolutely sure Fortune Smiles wouldn't save her from still being at 0HP.
Otherwise I agree with Ronways assesment that little buggaboo aside.
What other similar rulings? I couldn't think of any, I was simply going by the order of play for triggers.
Bee bot and EoD is a good example of the newest trigger taking precedence over an older trigger still occurring.
Playing a card is in fact a trigger for its text.
AkashBhuta. Plays disrupt the field. Destroy all environment cards first (activate any environmental destruction triggers that apply now). Then play the next villain card. Lets say its Primeval Eruption. You right now resolve Primeval Eruption before you move on to playing the next enviro card as Disrupt Field instructs. Again, newest triggers take precedence over older ones. There's many other examples like this.
Lady Luck plays the lucky card as part of its reveal trigger, so you would indeed heal up with fortune smiles. The real question is if its enough healing to get back above 0. I never though about Kismet working this way, but how that plays out thematically is pretty freakin cool.
Hmm... I guess it would have the chance of healing her. Might be interesting if the situation came up.
That's exactly the way I would think it would happen since Lady Luck doesn't actually stop her from taking damage. I do think that Fortune's Smile would save her, but I'd be fine playing it either way.
On the killing blow to Kismet, you would probably have to track into the negitive HP to make absolutely sure Fortune Smiles wouldn't save her from still being at 0HP.
Is there officially negative HP? That doesn't seem to make sense as the rules don't say at 0hp or less a target is destroyed, just at 0hp. I assumed there was no negative counting.
Yes, you can go into negative hp.
Certain specific situations can make you go into negative HP temporarily and perhaps recover
How does this effect damage from Absolute Zero? If something has 1hp and I hit it for 3 cold, do I get 1 damage toward Thermal Shockwave, or all 3? Would it be one under normal situations, but 3 with fixed point in play?
I kinda like this way of doing it. It makes me imagine Kismet desperately struggling to find a timeline where she doesn't lose, and (most likely) failing at the end.
But it would make perfect thematic sense that her fortune could save her from death as well no?
The way that it is worded in the rule book sounds like a trigger. It says…
when a villain character card is reduced to 0 HP, the villain is destroyed and the players have won the gamenot...
Whenever a villan charecter card has 0 or fewer hp, it is destroyed and the players have won.Why do you think that the win sequence keeps trying again?
(an argument for a diffrent thing)
Also, it's clear that the players do not win when they destroy one member of the Enead. And the "Shrine of the Enead" uses the same lanuage that "Lady Luck" does.
Whenever a villan(card/target) would be destroyed, do blah blah blah instead.thus wouldn't Kismet be saved by Lady Luck?