Prevalence of certain Attack abilities

So this quote over on the Venture Comics thread got me curious:

Now, that’s certainly true for Attack + Something Else. Those are probably the single most common ability type in the game, and you can always take a minor twist to turn a basic attack into a risky action that adds a ride. The effect of the riders are wildly variable, with some being quite situational and others being more broadly useful - and there’s a fair number where the Attack part is actually a Min die rider on some other type of action.

But what about the others? Abilities that allow Max die Attacks are pretty common (and can be achieved with risky basics as well) but how common? Well, if we just look at Green, only 1 of 20 power sources has a potential Max Attack, and only 6 of 20 archetypes (and one of those, Blaster, requires you to have Attacked or Hindered the target the previous round, so it may not always be available). That’s not actually a lot, and being able to throw a Max Attack in Green is a pretty meaningful benefit, especially if there’s a positive side effect like the one in Form-Changer.

When we expand to include both Green and Yellow the field broadens to 4 of 20 power sources, and 10 of 20 archetypes. Many Yellow options include further benefits like hitting other targets, rider effects with extra actions, etc. So that’s a lot more common, but it still means that there are 26 out of 40 total power sources and archetypes that can’t choose a Max die Attack ability before Red, and you’re much more likely to have gotten access through your archetype than your power source.

That’s not a huge big deal when using the constructed method to make characters, but with the semi-random guided method there’s a chance you may just not get the option on your dice no matter how you combine them. I can’t get a firm idea of how likely that is, but it’s worth noting that very high results on those tables are difficult or even impossible for some die sets to roll. Two of the Yellow-availability power sources (Genius and Extradimensional) require 15 and 17, and two of the archetypes (Form-Changer - one of the few Green zone Max Attacks - and Modular) require 16 and 20 to select with Method 1. Most die pools can’t even roll a 20, so that option is almost dead, and none of those others are very easy even with 2d10 or a d12 in your pool, which aren’t all that common.

FWIW, all but two of the various Red ability lists (Athletic powers and Information abilities) have some kind of Max die Attack to choose from, and the majority of them have much better than just Max, with either amazing riders or adding extra dice to the damage. You really have to work at it not to be able to choose a Max Attack ability in Red if you want.

The other top-tier Attack ability type that was mentioned is the small family of “Attack while ignoring your penalties, any Defend effects, and no reactions are allowed” abilities. These are rare as hen’s teeth, and can situationally outperform Max die Attack abilities. No power source includes one, and only 4 of 20 archetypes (specifically Marksman, Blaster, Close Quarters Combatant, and Armored) and in every one of those cases they’re available in Green. Marksman also has a Max Attack option in Yellow, both Blaster and CQC have Green Max Attacks available, and Armored doesn’t have a Max Attack at all unless it got one from its power source. If you’re randomizing, they’re all fairly accessible since none require higher than a 7.

There’s also 1 (and only 1) even better Red ability with this text, which has to be keyed to an intellectual power and bumps damage from the usual Mid to Max+Min, making it a real contender for best Attack ability in the game, competing with the likes of Charged-Up Blast.

So what’s all this mean? Well, you can always buy Max die damage with a minor twist, but Method 1 characters might be missing any ability that grants the same output - especially if they didn’t prioritize getting one in the power source stage and skipped choosing one when they could have. You can’t emulate the “no Defend” trick with twists unless you have a generous GM, and you can only get them in the archetype selection step or (in Red) if you took an Intellectual power, so those are going to be rarer.

If you’re using Method 2 (or secret Method 3, gods help us all) you can choose what you like but still need to realize some combos of power source and archetype can leave you without either option, which will likely impact your damage output meaningfully. Boosts can help enormously when it comes to making simpler Mid die Attacks hit as hard as Max die ones - but if you can combine Boosts with Max die (or Mid “no Defend”) Attacks they’ll be even more impressive.

IME the biggest danger to having too many low damage output heroes in a team isn’t in being unable to beat the baddies, it’s the fact that you may not be able to beat them fast enough to avoid the scene tracker timing out. If you can’t throw the big damage, you might need to look for scene-winning challenges to complete, scrubbing off environmental nuisances and minions/mid-sized lieutenants, or helping your heavier hitters with healing, Defends, or Boosts. Hinders can be useful too, but they’re often better at reducing villain effectiveness than finishing a scene faster, sadly.

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Okay, guess I should show my math!

I will admit, there are fewer “Ignore Defend” abilities than I thought. I would have guessed five or six, just because the four that exist are all pretty early.

When I’m looking at how likely heroes are to not just have Mid-die Attacks, I’m actually combining four major effects (setting aside “Attack and other” for the moment):

  1. Max Die attacks
  2. Attacks that ignore Defend
  3. Permanent/Exclusive Boosts that will bolster Attacks at no further cost
  4. Inherent or reactions that allow die rerolls, increasing your average results.

If you’re only looking in green, access to those is pretty easy. There are eight Power Sources that give one of those options, and a whopping 13 Archetypes (14, if you count Minion-Maker Boosting a minion or other hero instead of themselves). While not every character is going to have access to them, it’s going to be rare to not have anyone in the party without at least a couple and I’d expect over half the team to have at least one of those options. Expand into Yellow, and we’re up to fourteen Power Sources and fifteen Archetypes (seventeen if you count the ability to affect others on Minion Maker and Reality Shaper.)

The result is that heroes almost never need to stick with just a Mid die Attack if they don’t want to.

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Yeah, surprised me too. They’re all clumped early on, with the highest being Armored at 7. That actually makes them pretty easy for Method 1 users to access, which might contribute to the impression that they’re more common than they really are.

Looking back at the Method 2 heroes I’ve made over the years those archetypes are all somewhat over-represented in my stable, particularly Marksman (and Ray-D8 is contributing to that). I don’t think that’s because of the No-Defend abilities unto themselves, but I might be deluding myself.

Technically they never do, since there’s always risky basics on offer. But I agree with the overall math, even with Method 1 randoms it would be very rare to have 3-5 heroes all lacking something better than Mid + situational rider Attacks, especially by Yellow - which is a better metric than just looking at Greens anyway, since you spend way more time in it.

OTOH, it’s not impossible to be pretty thin on offense. I mean, look at the Pivotal Point Guards as a whole. Tomoe’s not throwing anything but Mid Attacks and really doesn’t Boost much, although her overall damage output is higher thanks to her Green reaction and she’s a defensive build overall. Althi’s got a No-Defend ability and some pretty good Mid+ damage options (that throw minion trick can be much better than Mid + Min) but her custom version of what’s usually a great group Boost rarely pays off for her. Your own damage output’s low without bonuses in place, but you’ve got an incredible Boost game and can crib the best of all our Green options with Mirrortech. Ray was deliberately (and rather torturously) built to fill gaps with a Green sweeper, a No-Defend, one of the best Green Boosters in the game, and two Yellow Mid Attacks with Max riders and a Max Attack with some dice-fixing to help out - but my die pools struggle to get two d10s in, and I wind up rolling 3d8 a lot more than I should.

That’s another subject I’m doing some data-mining on. Maybe I’ll stick it here when I get done, or start a fresh thread.