Recommend an H, V, and E for a dissatisfied newbie

Other Games SotM Game Engine
1

So, there's a friend who comes to our game group who I've shown SOTM to once; for her first game, we gave her Haka to play, and we happened to be fighting Iron Legacy for the first time (not really the ideal entry point, in retrospect).  When pitching the game to her, I admitted that if SOTM has a fault, it is that sometimes the game "kind of plays itself", and after IL finished pounding us all into jelly, she agreed that this had been an accurate characterization.  Today I spoke to her again, asking whether she'd try SOTM another time, and she agreed that one game wasn't enough to really judge by.  She said it "wasn't the best superhero game", (which, since she was probably comparing it to the DC Heroes Deckbuilding Game, is obviously ridiculous), but I did admit that starting with Haka would tend to contribute to the impression of simplicity, and she indicated a willingness to try another time, to see if the game would appeal more to her when it wasn't such a quick and straightforward slugfest.

So, now I want to set up a game for her next time, recommending a Hero she can play which will offer her a lot of choices (without being too overcomplected - I'm thinking the Argent Adept is not an ideal choice, for instance), and pick a Villain and Environment which will likewise help to create a favorable impression.  So I'm collecting suggestions on how to construct a game which will be fair, offer her a good sense of autonomy, and not be too complicated.  Off the top of my head, my best guess would be something like Baron Blade in the Tomb of Anubis with her as The Visionary...can anyone come up with a better suggestion?  Blade is not incredibly difficult, but he has some depth and variety with his various Devices and such, and if we play on Advanced, he'll have a good fast clock going to make sure the game offers a credible threat.  ToA is one of the hardest Environments, and in particular gives players several choices (mostly on the Trial cards), so I'm hoping that will reduce the sense of automation that I alluded to.  And while Visionary is probably better played by a slightly more accustomed player, she does at least give the player a LOT of choices (far more than she can routinely use), which is what I was going for here.  The biggest argument I can see against using her is the head-scratching scenario of having Brain Burn in your opening hand and going "why would I ever want to do this", but of course Brain Burn is literally designed to combat Baron Blade, so that's one more reason I think this might be a good match.  And ToA has plenty of dangerous cards to make Mass Levitation a non-dead card, plus the Baron has minions to Wrest and Ongoings to Divergence...I think it should be a fairly solid and well-rounded battle, but I'm certainly listening if someone has a better idea.

2

Yeah, I burned a few of my friends by giving them Visionary and Legacy as their first hereos, when we fought Akash-buta for the first time. It dragged on forever and they probably never want to play it again (including one who made a blog post about 'How not to make a co-op game', which even further gave Sentinels a bad rep. Don't get me wrong, I like this guy, but that was low. Especially since his blog is rather popular in Poland).

 

First of, heroes. A short list of heroes you should NEVER give to new players

-Absolute Zero: I love him and he can be used properly, but giving someone whose main power is "hurt yourself" is a bad idea, even if you explain it.

-Fanatic: A lot of cards require some forward thinking and preparation, which an new player won't have. Most of the time they'll waste their cards or do nothing, having no fun at all.

-Visionary: Same as Fanatic. We all know how Wrest the Mind and Twist the Ether can dominate the game, but don't expect a newbie to catch that on their first try. My guess is, they'll spend their turns using Mind Spikes and maybe controlling other decks. Not fun.

-Argent: No.

-Nightmist: "Oh cool, I can use spells and stuff! Lets see, this one hurts me... okay, the next one... hurts me even more, the next one doesn't do damage... this one makes me throw away cards and to get them I need to hurt myself more... this one lets me get more spells, which will hurt me... why is she your favourite again?"

-Omni-X: "Oh, cool, I have all those weapons and... wait, they're gone? But he only hit me once, what do you mean...?"

 

And my list of BEST for new players:

-Bunker: Sure he takes time to set-up, but see their grins when you destroy a few Voss minions while Ammo Drop is in play. And when they fire their full powered Omni-cannon at Voss's face.

-Tachyon: "She sucks, there's no damage, I just use those cards and not much happens, when am I going to do something usefu-... wait, Lightspeed Barrage? What's that? Oh. Wow. WOW!"

-Wraith: Let them know to tell you when they draw Improntu Invention. When they do, tell them "congratz, you won". Because they will.

-Haka: Smash. That is all.

-Ra: Burn. That is all.

-Tempest: This guy does EVERYTHING and hardly ever gets a bad card in play.

-Chrono Ranger: Time traveling cowboy with bunch of futuristic weaponry? Awesome. And he's cool to play to.

No words on Expat or Fixer, but I'll say 'NO' to them.

 

Villains, this list is short because anyone from expansions should be left for later. That said:

-Baron Blade: Has everything you need to know about villains, plus he is rather fast to play with.

-Voss: Despite rating 3, he's pretty easy and simple to understand. Especially reccomended when she uses Bunker with Ammo drop.

 

Enviroment: Megalopolis. Just Megalopolis. It's one of the fairest Enviroments, has a bit of everything and thematically, its a giant city, which is easier to imagine then island full of Dinos or 'Realm of Whattheheckisthis'. And it's much more forgiving then Rook City.

3

The character I would recommend as far as giving choices go is Tempest: You get 4 different powers, an incredidible amount of useful one shots, utility cards (into the stratosphere, reclaim from the deep), classic gene bound shackles and even a tanky ongoing... As far as choice goes it's really awesome and the character still will give a smooth ride like a cadillac and be newbie friendly.

 

If you want to kick it up a notch play the argent adept to let her use even MORE options with tempest extra card plays and powers will be appreciated. If you want everybody to have more options in hand get Team Leader Tachyon on the team. Unless your friend is a masochist who likes a real challenge I'd say go with classic Baron Blade. She already knows the destructive power of the game: Iron Legacy so winning a little could hook her more up. Then again you know her more than we do so you'll know what type of characters she'd play.

As far as environment goes I don't have a particullar mindset except volcano matches in insula primalis remain cool while still letting you master your destiny. I also liked Silver Gulch on my first game but that's because gunmen didn't seem to stand the crew more than we did.

4

I don't agree stay the hell away from environments that say anything along the line of don't play cards and don't use powers… You would instantly get the feeling of not controlling the game. Maybe I'm just unlucky but fair is not what comes to mind when I think Megalopolis.

5

Older thread on teaching SotM

It's interesting going back to read that, now, as we've changed how we do things for the "official" demos a little since then. For example, because Megalopolis actually prevents folks from doing things, we don't use it anymore.

6

Different situations are different and different people like different things.

 

While I'm happy to make a general suggestion (Baron Blade; Insula Primalis; Tempest, Ra, Chrono-Ranger, Haka, Fanatic, Tachyon, or Expatriette while someone else plays Legacy), if you know something about the person you're teaching, you can take that into consideration.

 

For instance, if they will be bored with too easy of a game, maybe stack Blade's deck or use Voss instead. If their attention needs to be grabbed right away, stack Insula Primalis so the most exciting dinosaurs are on top. If they will be bored if they don't have a lot to think about in regards their hero, consider the more complicated heroes but with some introduction. I've seen both Absolute Zero and NightMist be grokked immediately by new players. If the new player might be overwhelmed by the analysis of Absolute Zero, by the complexity of Argent Adept, by the obtuseness of The Scholar, and by the self-mutilation of NightMist, they still might enjoy someone like Tachyon if they are primed up front that they have two cards that take advantage of the number of Burst cards in their trash or Bunker if they get an intro to his modes and the advice to make the best of what you've got rather than try for the ultimate combination.

 

Finally, let's talk about The Wraith. She's been called overpowered, she doesn't get called very complicated, yet she rarely comes up in discussions of heroes to give to new players. She has a reasonable amount of direct attacks, so I think even new players that might not appreciate her other capabilities as much will have something to do. For someone who might get bored with a more straightforward damage dealer, I think The Wraith would be an excellent choice. Plus, female, and I think it reasonably likely to appeal to a female gamer to get to play a non-exploitative female hero.

7

Heroes: I usually have new players choose between Wraith, Tempest, Ra, or Haka. The first two give them a lot of choices but don't require a ton of planning; the last two let them do a whole mess of damage, which new players often enjoy.

Environment: Never Megalopolis. It's relatively simple, but there's just way too much of: "Wait, what can't I do this turn?". I want new players to feel energized and inspired, not shut down. I usually play in The Block or Silver Gulch. They are easy to explain, relatively simple in terms of mechanics, and they give the players more things to do rather than taking them away.

Villains: I always have them play regular Baron Blade first. His mechanics are fairly straightforward. He's got a compelling storyline that you can relate in about a minute. And the reveal when he flips is great. I don't tell them about the front/back side mechanic beforehand, so they don't know that he'll pull himself out of the wreckage and start chasing after the heroes until it happens.

My aim is usually for the first game to be quick - to get comfortable with the mechanics. I let them make all the mistakes they want while facing Blade. After we steamroll him anyway, the next question is: "Ok. Now do you want to try a more challenging battle?" The answer is nearly always an enthusiastic yes.

8

I'd go with Tachyon.

Tachyon gives a lot of options, and with a few good cards (HUD) starts to get really fun.  Just don't play as Legacy, he gives people the idea that Tach is a wicked damage dealer in the wrong way.

Tempest is also a great option.

Villain I'd go Voss.  He doesn't have the ongoing cards that you want to destroy, but killing him never gets old, and every once in a while he steamrolls you right when you think you are okay, just don't go advanced with a tachyon because she never gets to deal damage.

Environment Insula Primalis:  Dinosaurs and Alien invaders, obsidian fields making everything nasty, it has card destruction and things that eat minions for you that you ned to plan for.

 

For other heroes I'd throw in a Fixer, it is so easy to teach the game when you are fixer, you don't dominate the game, but with a timely grease gun or riveting crane, or alternating+hoist chain you can set others up for a win.

If there are other players, give someone else Haka, she saw him before, let someone shine with him, he is simple, but smashing things is still fun, and groundpound is a great super power to help a new player win without feeling like the villain was nerfed.  Alternately go Tempest or Expat here.

Lastly throw in Visionary.  Play her yourself and save reordering the villain deck for times when things are bad, don't dominate the game, just help others find the right cards, mitigate the nasty situations, and resist taking over and crushing the life out of Voss with your huge brain.

9

Wraith, Tachyon, Fanatic, Tempest, Unity (depending on the villain; NEVER against Plague Rat), and the like are all good.

I like Insula Primalis for an environment, and pick a basic villain, like Voss or Apostate.

10

 

Apostate basic? When the gauntlets come out, you've got to keep track of the extra attacks. You've got to watch out for cards pulling other cards out of the trash/deck – extra work both in terms of keeping track of what's going on and in planning for what may come. You've also got to deal with all of that damage reduction, a pain to be sure, but also another reason it's important to plan for what may come.

11

Well, maybe Basic was the wrong word to use. Maybe middle-ground. He's not a super-long game like La Capitan, but he's not super-short like Iron Legacy. He's easier than most "difficult" villains, but more of a challenge than Baron Blade. He's more complex than Ambuscade or Akash'Bhuta (kill everything), but given that the only major strategy is "kill the Relics FIRST, THEN kill him" makes him a lot more simple than, say, the Chairman, The Matriarch, Dawn, Omnitron, The Ennead, The Dreamer, or Miss Information.

 

He teaches basics of important strategery and tough decisions, without being nearly the ball-busting experience some of the other villains can be for new players. Plus, if there are experienced players as well, odds are they won't want to do someone SUPER easy, like Blade. I only do Blade when I'm the only veteran in the group.

12

I haven't see Expat much and given the current printing of Rook City I'm not sure how available she is but I have had nothing but good luck in introducing new players with her.  Bonus points if you have a female player.  I would definitely stay away from the Visionary she has a terrible track record with new people.

 

For villains, Blade is always a good choice, but I must say I also think Ambuscade works well.  I don't know, I guess I really like his playstyle.

 

As far as Environments I have to second Insula Primalis.  Another one that I've used is the Realm of Discord, as it is kind of neat as the effects tend to change each turn with only being able to have 1 distortion in play at a time.  Also, people tend to really dig the art in the Realm of Discord.

 

Good luck with whatever your choice is.

13

I actually really liked Visionary when I played as her as a beginner, but I'm kind of weird that way. I like the supporters.

Other good environments include Discord, Atlantis, and the Time Cataclysm. It's still one of my favorites.

14

I introduced my cousin to the game on Thanksgiving. We played a whole lot of games (Voss, The Chairman, and Plague Rat stomped us, we crushed Spite, Ennead, and Omnitron) and throughout them all he used Mr. Fixer plus another hero (I controlled a third hero, environment, and villain). He absolutley fell in love with Fixer because every time he'd draw driving mantis and redirect. It was ridiculous how often 3-1 (he also tended to draw the wrench) damage was thrown about and he fell in love with being able to force someone to punch themselves in the face when they were trying to hit him. Spite in particular really despised him.

15

Despite having known this lady for many years, I don't feel that I know her well enough to guess too much about her preferences.  Offhand the only one of her favorite games I can think of is Corsari/Igo (she also plays Lost Cities a lot, but I think her boyfriend is much more into that than she is, and she likes Uptown but I don't know anything about it), and I can't think of how to translate that into a SOTM playstyle.  I second the decision that Megalopolis is a bad choice; I've often regarded it as a decent teaching environment, but certainly not for a player who's already become a little bored (our first game was in The Block, which I consider the "safest" environment, but it might have been an unwise choice for this reason).  I also think that Chrono-Ranger, while possibly quite appealing, would cause option paralysis in the early game if she drew a search card in his opening hand - she has seen someone else play him, but I doubt she was really studying what other players were doing while trying to follow the game herself for the first time.

I've got an extremely smart friend who started with Absolute Zero and grokked him within a few turns, and one of his buddies enjoyed playing Legacy in his first game and Omnitron-X in the second.

Based on some of the advice so far, I'm thinking I'll offer her a choice between Tempest, the Wraith, and maybe one other hero I haven't decided on, Bunker perhaps.  Then I'll let her choose whether we should fight Baron Blade or Warlord Voss, and if she chooses Blade I'll make it advanced (he's just too much of a wimp otherwise, plus the clock gives the game some real pressure).  I'm not feeling Insula as an environment, but perhaps I'll suck it up and use that one, since I can't come up with a better idea.  I suppose I could offer the choice between it and the Tomb....

16

I'm particular to Realm of Discord, since it does interesting play effects, but it can be difficult for new players.

17

When I introduce people to the game, I use the following combinations :)

Heroes:

Wraith- she's my go to intro hero, precisely because she can do everything. Plus, it gives the feel for the game better than most other heroes.

Ra- if I feel like they just want to win

Tempest- another simple one :)

 

Villain:

BB- same as everyone else!

GW- To make them feel good about themselves :))

Rat- Fast paced intro game :)

 

Environment:

Megapolis

Insula Primalis

18

It's not her first game, though, it's her second.  I'm not trying to introduce her; I'm trying to get her hooked.

19

For that I almost always go Tachyon.

Tachyon is fun, fast and powerful.  She can destroy cards, nuke, shut down damage and just overall wins.

Voss is a great enemy to use, since he can stop Tachyon's 1 damage shots with Guard (again, don't go advanced) and with Primalis and Voss not having any ongoing you need to destroy quick Primalis becomes a great target for blinding speed, while also bringing some insanity to the game.  A field or two gets out and Tachyon gets to be an epic destroyer, but so do the minions.

It is simply a great combo for a simple yet fun and dangerous feeling time.

20

Technically, destroying Forced Deployment quickly is something you might want to do - if it comes out, the earlier you can get rid of it in a round, the more turns you have before it gets around to Voss's turn and you get beaten up by all the remaining Minions ;).