Savage Mana vs Incapacitated Characters

Other Games SotM Game Engine
1

Refer to previous discussion here. http://sentinelsofthemultiverse.com/forum/topic/chairmanoperative-question

We encountered this problem again and it wasn't definitively answered in the previous thread.

Official ruling says that Chairman (and I presume can be extended to all other villian characters such as Omnitron) can go under Savage Mana.

Question is, can other targets with an Incapacitated side go under Savage Mana? I.e. Hero characters, Operative, Ennead.

If so, there exists player elimination? Because the incapacitated hero that went under Savage Mana can't use his incapacitated powers anymore.

2

I think the crux comes form the idea that cards only go under Savage Mana when they are destroyed.  Cards with incapacitated sides flip to their other side "when they would be destroyed", thus meaning they are not, in fact, destroyed.

3

broccoli is correct. Cards with "Incapacitated" sides are not destroyed. The Chairman is. He's special that way.

4

I was actually going to say something like that, just not as simple.

Basically, the rules state that heroes are flipped to their incapaciated side if they would be destroyed.  Also, all villain character cards with incapacitated sides state either on the character card, or on another card, that if they would be destroyed, they instead flip to their incapaciated side.  All other villains either have the default win condition upon being destroyed, or actually state what would happen if they would be destroyed.  Given that "would be destroyed" should occur before "destroyed" (mainly because would be destroyed indicates that descructon has not yet occured and typically cancels the destruction, and destroyed indicates that destruction has in fact occured), those that have incapacitated sides, as well as cards that react to their potential destruction (i.e. Baron Blade, Omnitron, and Apostate) cannot be destroyed.

Based on this, I would be left to believe that The Chairman is the only character card that can actually be destroyed while not setting off an end game, putting The Chairman in the unique position of being able to be absorbed by Savage Mana.

(It's been stated before that Omnitron could also be absorbed by Savage Mana, but that was prior to the Enhanced Edition, back when Omnitron stated an effect to happen when it was reduced to 0 or fewer HP, as it now states if it would be destroyed).

5

I don't have the cards in front of me -- what is it about the Chairman that makes him special in this regard?  Why can he be destroyed when no other character card can be?

6

Most other character cards are destroyed, like The Chairman, it's just that he's the only one who can be destroyed and have the game not end. If, for instance, Spite is dropped to 0 HP, he's destroyed and the game is over. Since the game is over, Haka doesn't stuff him under Savage Mana to save up for the next fight. The only other villains that can be defeated without the game immediately ending specify other things. The Operative and the Ennead are incapacitated, rather than destroyed, and Omnitron specifies that he is removed from play.

7

Ah, thanks.  I'll add a note to my Clarifications doc to make that clear, next chance I get.

8

I see. Thanks everyone